[grip_daddy]

The chapter describes briefly the origin of sin and consequences both temporal and eternal that arose due to man's act of disobedience. Reading this chapter critically reveals some contradictions that I would seek clarifications:

1. How was it that the serpent was carning? Was it created as such or ability to beguile is not in itself sinful?

2. Was the curse on the serpent to eat dust literal? Most snakes eat animals and insects.

3. The bible says elsewhere that only Christ's death can give a sinful man hope to live again. How then could the tree of life have given man some eternity in disregard to God's will? Did the tree of life contain self sustaining life apart from God that warranted protection by Cherubims? If man ate the tree of life after he had sinned, could he have acquired immortality beyond God's ability to destroy?

[Ebony *Dyme*]

what i know for sure is that if you take some of the meanings of the bible literally then you'll be there all day, i think most of them hold a more 'deeper' meaning than what they describe, imagine reading revelations and taking the stuff literal?

[grip_daddy]

Originally Posted by Ebony *Dyme*

what i know for sure is that if you take some of the meanings of the bible literally then you'll be there all day, i think most of them hold a more 'deeper' meaning than what they describe, imagine reading revelations and taking the stuff literal?

The non literal understanding is what I would appreciate. Remember when the interpretation has been twisted to mean implied meanings, diverse schools of thoughts emerge which ultimately cause confusion. So, how do you approach Genesis in a non literal angle?

If scriptural texts seem to have been locked, a key is always said to be provided, or rather a lead to unlocking it. Revelation unlocks itself, what about Genesis?

[Ebony *Dyme*]

revelation unlocks its-self?
well what genesis states is that the serpernt was the most cunning creature that the lord God had created, i get what you mean, maybe they meant cunning as in clever/wise, we know that lucifer (if that's who the serpernt was) was the wisest creation of God

about eating dust, you know the expression, 'eat my dust?' maybe thats what it meant, that he will always be trampled on by God and his followers

about number three, i would guess that adam and eve had sinned in their minds first (i mean the disobedience/sin was planted in their minds first) before they ate the fruit. The tree of life in my opinion is knowledge, did God not want human beings to be wise and self-sufficient? did he only create us to reproduce, worship him, and cultivate the land? i don't know

[ndigila]

Originally Posted by grip_daddy

1. How was it that the serpent was carning? Was it created as such or ability to beguile is not in itself sinful?

The answer to this question depends on whether you view the serpent as the devil or not.

Originally Posted by grip_daddy

2. Was the curse on the serpent to eat dust literal? Most snakes eat animals and insects.

I think you already answered that question.

Originally Posted by grip_daddy

3. The bible says elsewhere that only Christ's death can give a sinful man hope to live again. How then could the tree of life have given man some eternity in disregard to God's will? Did the tree of life contain self sustaining life apart from God that warranted protection by Cherubims? If man ate the tree of life after he had sinned, could he have acquired immortality beyond God's ability to destroy?

No, Adam was prevented from eating the tree of life because if he did, he would have been stuck in a fallen state for eternity.

[grip_daddy]

revelation unlocks its-self?

For example the phrase Testimony of Jesus in Rev 1:2 is explained to be Spirit of Prophecy in Rev 19:10. The phrase everlasting fire is said to be the second death, while the seven heads are explained to be seven kings etc. Almost all the coded language have a meaning in the book itself that careful scrutiny will unearth.

well what genesis states is that the serpernt was the most cunning creature that the lord God had created, i get what you mean, maybe they meant cunning as in clever/wise, we know that lucifer (if that's who the serpernt was) was the wisest creation of God


I think an actual literal serpent was involved. How then do you explain the curse of scrolling on the belly? Was the cunning meant to say that it was wiser than other animals?Wiser than man?

about eating dust, you know the expression, 'eat my dust?' maybe thats what it meant, that he will always be trampled on by God and his followers

This sounds nice and easy to buy.

about number three,

I think this was a literal tree. I just want to know how it could give life.

[grip_daddy]

No, Adam was prevented from eating the tree of life because if he did, he would have been stuck in a fallen state for eternity.

As in he could have died forever not being able to be rescued? Or how could he have stuck in a fallen state for eternity?

[ndigila]

Originally Posted by grip_daddy

As in he could have died forever not being able to be rescued? Or how could he have stuck in a fallen state for eternity?

The statement "You shall die" indicates both a physical and spiritual death. The spiritual death is a separation from God and it is this that is referred to as the fallen state. The physical death ensures that the spiritual death wouldn't last forever.

[truuth]

This is Paul in roman saying;7:-24

7What shall we say then,is the law sin? God forbid. Howbeit, I had not known sin, except through the law: for I had not known coveting, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet: 8but sin, finding occasion, wrought in me through the commandment all manner of coveting: for apart from the law sin is dead. 9 And I was alive apart from the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died; 10 and the commandment, which was unto life, this I found to be unto death: 11 for sin, finding occasion, through the commandment beguiled me, and through it slew me. 12 So that the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and righteous, and good. 13 Did then that which is good become death unto me? God forbid. But sin, that it might be shown to be sin, by working death to me through that which is good; --that through the commandment sin might become exceeding sinful. 14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin. 15 For that which I do I know not: for not what I would, that do I practise; but what I hate, that I do. 16 But if what I would not, that I do, I consent unto the law that it is good. 17 So now it is no more I that do it, but sin which dwelleth in me. 18 For I know that in me, that is, in my flesh, dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me, but to do that which is good is not. 19For the good which I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I practise. 20But if what I would not, that I do, it is no more I that do it, but sin which dwelleth in me. 21I find then the law, that, to me who would do good, evil is present. 22For I delight in the law of God after the inward man: 23but I see a different law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity under the law of sin which is in my members. 24Wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me out of the body of this death?

God is polarised in order for us to see the possibilities of who he is.He exists in every aspect of life,and always for good.Sin and everything thats comes with the serpent is there for us to see the other side.We wouldn't know righteousness unless we understood what sin is.
God says behold I give you Life or death;Choose LIFE.

[grip_daddy]

Originally Posted by ndigila

The physical death ensures that the spiritual death wouldn't last forever.

If Adam ate the tree of life, he could not have died physically so his fallen state could not have been rescued? That does mean that a mere tree had power to perpetuate life, physical or otherwise, beyond the control of God?

Personally I think the reason for chasing the couple from the garden of Eden to where they were created from was misunderstood by the writer of Genesis.

To me, so I think, the tree of life was meant as a privileged meal only allowed to a holy sinless being. It's eating after sin could equal accessing heavenly treasures that would simply negate the purpose of its specialty. I dont think it had an inherent capability to give whatever life, physical or spiritual, by itself apart from God.