[youngben]

Originally Posted by Type R

Continental population densities: -

Asia, 87 per sq. km.
Europe, 70 per sq. km.
Africa, 30 per sq. km.
North America 21 per sq. km
South America, 20 per sq. km.
Australia, 2.8 per sq. km.

Don't know if this will help this discussion.

am having communication limitations so cannot be detailed.

Type R - could you possibly provide the same info but now against arable/inhabitable land?

[deliriumtremens]

Originally Posted by atabong

this post is a copy and paste job; the original author is a white supremacist (guy white: whttp://www.globalpolitician.com/23759-poverty) who probably knows nothing about 'africa before colonization' his naive narrative is a classical example of history lessons taught in western classrooms even as we now speak. He seems to paint an idiot’s picture of africa standing at one spot from the time of pre-colonization till now if colonization had never happened.slavery, colonization, oppression, neo-colonialism, bad publicity has undeniable left a persisting scar on the black man’s psyche. Deliriumtremens should bring out more ideas ‘of his own’ and stop acting like a ‘black gateman in a white neighborhood’

my congratulalations to your google research atabong. It mystifies me as to why you have a problem with that post being copied and pasted? i admit having done that for some reasons. The article fully reflects my opinion and that is what counts. Why typing a similar post when it’s already there? i would have written exactly the same but to copy it was just easier. Why would that article anyway be an “idiots” job? is it because the author has a different opinion than you? is anyone that has a negative opinion about black african history a white supremacist? it is still politically correct to say bad things about whites (and only about whites), while saying good things (and only good things) about blacks. I could have made a post with just a link to that site, but in that case i would have missed all the attention i got from you. You are not much different aren’t you? just have a look at your post “does time exist” it’s a copy and paste job from existence - wikipedia, the free encyclopedia get a grip dude…

[Atabong]

Originally Posted by deliriumtremens

my congratulalations to your google research atabong. It mystifies me as to why you have a problem with that post being copied and pasted? i admit having done that for some reasons. The article fully reflects my opinion and that is what counts. Why typing a similar post when it’s already there? i would have written exactly the same but to copy it was just easier. Why would that article anyway be an “idiots” job? is it because the author has a different opinion than you? is anyone that has a negative opinion about black african history a white supremacist? it is still politically correct to say bad things about whites (and only about whites), while saying good things (and only good things) about blacks. I could have made a post with just a link to that site, but in that case i would have missed all the attention i got from you. You are not much different aren’t you? just have a look at your post “does time exist” it’s a copy and paste job from existence - wikipedia, the free encyclopedia get a grip dude…

Is Africa the Problem or the Problem Africans? Is a very personal question, a question I asked myself for the first time when I first left Africa. This question has haunted me ever since, ‘I really did not know I’m black till I left Africa’, most Africans who have been overseas will tell you the same. Everything I write is purely a reflection of personal thoughts and experiences.

Does Time Exist? Is a Question I have asked myself since December 2004.I have fought a battle with my consciousness trying to answer the same question? I have discussed the topic with friends, Scholars and Philosophers, I have researched in some of the World’s best Libraries, I have traveled across continents asking the same question. I have ‘googled up’ the Internet; there were times I was unable to sleep asking myself the same question. A friend of mine Nicole who is specialized in Egyptology gave me a lot of moral support on this.

I must confess that when I read 'your' post it spoiled my whole day, my heart palpitated; my temperature rose, I felt like I had been bitten by a ‘fire ant’, I had to present an argument against it, so I started researching. The following day I found that your post had been so stupidly copied and pasted, ward verbatim. It’s the most naïve and ego driven write-up I ever read on Africa. It has all the hallmarks of Racism; I also researched on your friend Guy white and discovered he is a White Supremacist. Truly, you act like a Black gateman in a white neighborhood

Don’t rigmarole, Deliriumtremens. Stop picking nuts; Let’s engage in mature debate. Your post came from here [whttp://www.globalpolitician.com/23759-poverty], copied and pasted word verbatim, can you say this of my posts?

delirioumtremens, This is one of your ludicrous posts

Originally Posted by deliriumtremens

I found out that in the year 1066 b.c., the ooga-booga tribe in central africa had a noble and wise chief known as ooogla-boogla...

[Luoliability]

Originally Posted by Smartass

Africa is doing poorly according to whom?
If you read history you may free yourself of the feeling of despair and frustration at the fate of Africa
Civilisations rise and fall, when the Chinese and Japanese had well planned cities with roads and sewage disposal methods the Europeans lived in cramped buildings and emptied their chamber pots on to the streets, it was not genius or planning that led them to change but calamity in the from of the plague and cholera.
When Pythagoras was seeking mathematical knowledge in Timbuktu the worlds centre of learning (in the Mali kingdom) the Europeans were fighting tribal wars When the pharaohs who were black (check out the pictures on Prof, Manu Ampim site) he Europeans were hunter gatherers.
My point is Kingdoms rise and wane. Who would have thought the sun would ever set on the British Empire or the USSR would crumble or the dollar would weaken or that there would be another currency to counter the dollar?

Do not despair its just our place in time in the vicissitudes of life we have had our highs these are our lows

Why should we wane when for centuries now we have all the resources that feed todays civilization. See my posting in mashada called coup' de'tat that also has a bearing on this.
We need that rich African civilization to be born again.

[mtaveta]

We have to free up our minds!

Originally Posted by atabong

this question i ask myself every day. Can there be any reasonable explanation to why we africans are so poor, so backward, so underprivileged, so left behind? so beggarly and so looked upon as bull****? some one said to me: look if our people had not colonized you guys you’d still be going around naked and killing each other with spears. First the western people were here exploring and exploiting, dragging us in chains out to the plantations in the west. They created an outcry then change the method. They bring religion, divide us, and create wars, poverty, disease, ignorance, hunger and starvation and so nowadays we have neocolonialism. Our people no longer have to be carried away bare feet and in chains but flee to the west to do slave labour. Are our leaders so dumb, so inhuman, really do black african leaders think at all, let alone have a ‘conscience’? the chinese and asians are slowly but surely seeping in too. Does black africa have any way to protect itself from these invaders? we are gradually seeing our lands, forests, property etc bought over with the same money that is taken from our land and the proceeds pushed back to the invaders by our own leaders. Sub saharan africa economies are the worst on the planet, does it mean we cannot manufacture and consume our own products? why do we have to starve and die in a land oozing with oil and diamonds? in fact the big powers don't even need to wage a war to get in. We pass around town and find shelved bottled water imported from holland, france etc we read and watch western and foreign media, googgle out 'sub saharan africa' on the internet and we’re dumfounded with what we see. In the west, the only thing most people know of africa is on their outright racist news channels, big billboards showing fleshless black men and women overpowered by disease, houseflies hovering over starving children. Even black people living in the west are demoralized. No body knows what to do, isn’t it time for us as africans to portray the good we have? really, is africa the problem or the problem africans? can some one say something

[Type R]

Originally Posted by deliriumtremens

my congratulalations to your google research atabong. It mystifies me as to why you have a problem with that post being copied and pasted? i admit having done that for some reasons. The article fully reflects my opinion and that is what counts. Why typing a similar post when it’s already there? i would have written exactly the same but to copy it was just easier. Why would that article anyway be an “idiots” job? is it because the author has a different opinion than you? is anyone that has a negative opinion about black african history a white supremacist? it is still politically correct to say bad things about whites (and only about whites), while saying good things (and only good things) about blacks. I could have made a post with just a link to that site, but in that case i would have missed all the attention i got from you. You are not much different aren’t you? just have a look at your post “does time exist” it’s a copy and paste job from existence - wikipedia, the free encyclopedia get a grip dude…

delerium,

When I read the post, I instinctively asked whether you were black. You did not reply. Instead, you countered, "Why else would you ask me whether am black? Does my skin color has anything to do with my post?" A person who cannot say "Yes" or "No" to simple questions is suspicious!

First of all, the post was not yours. So the "my post" quip is insincere!!!

It turns out that my hunch was accurate! The genuine author of the article - Guy White - is evidently as white man. If you had been honest, you would have informed me that the article was written by a white man. Instead, you jumped into irrelevant drivel and political counter-offensives.

"It mystifies me as to why you have a problem with that post being copied and pasted?"

Not so mystical. The main problem with the copied article is that it does not flow from the points raised in the preceding posts. That is the problem of copy-and-paste.

Various posters discussed several ideas before your "Xerox", here's a sample: -

Atabong: "are our leaders dumb?"
Atabong: "do our leaders have a conscience?"
Smartass: "Kingdoms rise and fall"
Telvin: "I believe Africans are the problem. Our problems start at the top with poor and corrupt (financially/morally) leaders. We also don't work hard enough to improve our situation. We don't want to invest in research, infrastructure etc. and that is why we cannot develop."
Biblereader: "I would attribute africa failures to just one single vice."Lies"
BBB: "Africans dont think and are greedy. Aslo the tribal issue"
tic tac: "the biggest problem we face as a continent is diversity. we are torn apart by the many tribes"
froggy: "40 years after westerners pulled out, the Kenyan state is imploding solely because of tribal rivalry, hatred and mistrust. How are westerners to blame for that? We conduct shoddy elections, kill each other, ruin our economy and precipitate a civil war, then half of us die: which westerner is to blame for that?"
Atabong: "We can now see very clearly for our selves how the Africa created by Westerners is the problem."
milanya: "The westerners ruled Africa by the principle of divide and conquer"

From all these points (except the last), you can see an overall tendency to assume responsibility for our African situation. Both Europeans and Africans have influenced our history.

That's why the following point is like a lightning bolt on a clear sunny day.

"It makes me sick to the bone that we Africans have to blame Whites for all our self inflicted misery's."

It was a counter-point to a point that had never been made on this forum. To the contrary, most of the posters on this forum had been very fair - when a African leader displayed certain faults, they said so. When colonialists did what they did (we can't pretend away their influence, can we?), these actions of theirs - recorded in history books published in Europe and America by European and American historians - we must assign the responsibility for a conscious action to its doer.

Guy White seems to be a white American who is fighting a hostility that is specifically found in the USA. If you were honest, you would have told me that. Instead of the insincere "what does the colour of my skin...blah blah" That article may be relevant to the USA.

To copy an article like that in a fair forum like this amounts to saying, "Discuss trashy African leaders but leave trashy white colonialists out of this." A racist approach, if you ask me. No one is holy. You screw up, we will point it out - even if your skin made of pure gold, Midas!!!

[HUH?]

Originally Posted by Type R

delerium,

When I read the post, I instinctively asked whether you were black. You did not reply. Instead, you countered, "Why else would you ask me whether am black? Does my skin color has anything to do with my post?" A person who cannot say "Yes" or "No" to simple questions is suspicious!

First of all, the post was not yours. So the "my post" quip is insincere!!!

It turns out that my hunch was accurate! The genuine author of the article - Guy White - is evidently as white man. If you had been honest, you would have informed me that the article was written by a white man. Instead, you jumped into irrelevant drivel and political counter-offensives.

"It mystifies me as to why you have a problem with that post being copied and pasted?"

Not so mystical. The main problem with the copied article is that it does not flow from the points raised in the preceding posts. That is the problem of copy-and-paste.

Various posters discussed several ideas before your "Xerox", here's a sample: -

Atabong: "are our leaders dumb?"
Atabong: "do our leaders have a conscience?"
Smartass: "Kingdoms rise and fall"
Telvin: "I believe Africans are the problem. Our problems start at the top with poor and corrupt (financially/morally) leaders. We also don't work hard enough to improve our situation. We don't want to invest in research, infrastructure etc. and that is why we cannot develop."
Biblereader: "I would attribute africa failures to just one single vice."Lies"
BBB: "Africans dont think and are greedy. Aslo the tribal issue"
tic tac: "the biggest problem we face as a continent is diversity. we are torn apart by the many tribes"
froggy: "40 years after westerners pulled out, the Kenyan state is imploding solely because of tribal rivalry, hatred and mistrust. How are westerners to blame for that? We conduct shoddy elections, kill each other, ruin our economy and precipitate a civil war, then half of us die: which westerner is to blame for that?"
Atabong: "We can now see very clearly for our selves how the Africa created by Westerners is the problem."
milanya: "The westerners ruled Africa by the principle of divide and conquer"

From all these points (except the last), you can see an overall tendency to assume responsibility for our African situation. Both Europeans and Africans have influenced our history.

That's why the following point is like a lightning bolt on a clear sunny day.

"It makes me sick to the bone that we Africans have to blame Whites for all our self inflicted misery's."

It was a counter-point to a point that had never been made on this forum. To the contrary, most of the posters on this forum had been very fair - when a African leader displayed certain faults, they said so. When colonialists did what they did (we can't pretend away their influence, can we?), these actions of theirs - recorded in history books published in Europe and America by European and American historians - we must assign the responsibility for a conscious action to its doer.

Guy White seems to be a white American who is fighting a hostility that is specifically found in the USA. If you were honest, you would have told me that. Instead of the insincere "what does the colour of my skin...blah blah" That article may be relevant to the USA.

To copy an article like that in a fair forum like this amounts to saying, "Discuss trashy African leaders but leave trashy white colonialists out of this." A racist approach, if you ask me. No one is holy. You screw up, we will point it out - even if your skin made of pure gold, Midas!!!

I don't think "plagiarism" is in delirium's vocab.

[deliriumtremens]

I guess that I’m just tired of all that white , black, asian, slavery, colonialism junk.
I also know that this is mainly a forum of black people and the opinion of any other member of a different race is to be dismissed as racial. My opinions will even encourage most of you to call me a racist – go ahead I don’t give a F…k
The Irish were slaves, the Chinese were slaves, Christians were tortured and thrown to the lions, Russians were the slaves of Mongolians for over 300 years, Finland was under colonial rule for the bigger part of its history. Germany was bombed out by the British as well as the Japanese by the US
Fact is that none of these countries ever blamed anyone but themselves for their miseries; they just rebuilt their infrastructures and re-instated democratic governments without foreign help.
We all know that (this one goes to Huh) that the US achieved its status as super power on costs of African slaves. The Americans profited in every aspect from slave labor and later on by “forced volunteers” to their Vietnam and Iraq wars.
Today, African Americans (what a nonsense) claim reparations for above mentioned reasons.
I’d say fine, the Jews got compensated (and still are) for the holocaust and Indians still have the right to booze and gambling in the US. But what about crime in the US, by mainly “African brothers”. 50 % of inmates are of “African American” origin. The bigger part of government welfare goes to the “brothers” as well.
You are more likely to be killed or raped by a “brother” than by a White, Asian or Hispanic. The term “Ho” for a female just gives a clue of how much the brothers have advanced the last 3000 years.
Of course, that all must come from a white supremacist guy that never put foot on African soil (R type) I just assume that R type has never been in Lodwar. If he were, he would have realized that this is Kenya as well. Instead he was sitting behind his company computer “having the feeling that something racism” is going on. I volunteer since 20 years for a Christian NGO (just another colonial power) to help with my knowledge and manpower to make things better in some forsaken regions. I myself despise Religion and especially Christianity but I pretended to be part of it just to do SOMETHING.
My point is, THERE ARE NO KENYANS that even contribute a single cent for drilling a borehole that could mean life or death to these people.
It seems to me that Kenya consists only of Luo and Kikuyu culture and all other Kenyan tribes are considered primitive. You guys are racists in your own house but have the guts to call others the same.
Most of my friends are “superior” Kenyans of above mentioned tribes and I know what they say and think about each other.
Let me tell you that I live and work in Africa since 20 years. I have 2 children with a Nigga Ho of whom I very proud of. I spend most of my time assisting people in environments that are considered hostile for NO PAY! What does an African do for his own people and for no pay – NOTHING!
But that’s ok with me, in my society is not much of a difference but there is one particular experience I had that could have never had happened anywhere in Europe;
On my second visit to Kenya I was in an ASC bus that collected me and other tourists from the airport. We encountered a huge traffic jam at Mombasa causeway because of an accident.
I had enough time to observe of how an accident victim which was still alive has been ripped of f his shoes and other valuables whilst a crowd of spectators watching. There was nobody amongst those Kenyan people trying to help that pour soul.
The “Proud to be Kenyan” sticker!!! Did you ever hear about people in other countries to pull off such desperate attempt of self hypnosis? Proud of what??? Face it people you can’t’ even maintain your own roads, communications networks and a democracy without expatriates.
Instead to welcome expats that could contribute to technical advancement in Kenya your immigration department is hostile towards foreigners.
If that is the cradle of all mankind I feel ashamed being part of it.

To be continued if your ignorance allows it…

[Atabong]

Originally Posted by deliriumtremens

I guess that I’m just tired of all that white , black, asian, slavery, colonialism junk.
I also know that this is mainly a forum of black people and the opinion of any other member of a different race is to be dismissed as racial. My opinions will even encourage most of you to call me a racist – go ahead I don’t give a F…k
The Irish were slaves, the Chinese were slaves, Christians were tortured and thrown to the lions, Russians were the slaves of Mongolians for over 300 years, Finland was under colonial rule for the bigger part of its history. Germany was bombed out by the British as well as the Japanese by the US
Fact is that none of these countries ever blamed anyone but themselves for their miseries; they just rebuilt their infrastructures and re-instated democratic governments without foreign help.
We all know that (this one goes to Huh) that the US achieved its status as super power on costs of African slaves. The Americans profited in every aspect from slave labor and later on by “forced volunteers” to their Vietnam and Iraq wars.
Today, African Americans (what a nonsense) claim reparations for above mentioned reasons.
I’d say fine, the Jews got compensated (and still are) for the holocaust and Indians still have the right to booze and gambling in the US. But what about crime in the US, by mainly “African brothers”. 50 % of inmates are of “African American” origin. The bigger part of government welfare goes to the “brothers” as well.
You are more likely to be killed or raped by a “brother” than by a White, Asian or Hispanic. The term “Ho” for a female just gives a clue of how much the brothers have advanced the last 3000 years.
Of course, that all must come from a white supremacist guy that never put foot on African soil (R type) I just assume that R type has never been in Lodwar. If he were, he would have realized that this is Kenya as well. Instead he was sitting behind his company computer “having the feeling that something racism” is going on. I volunteer since 20 years for a Christian NGO (just another colonial power) to help with my knowledge and manpower to make things better in some forsaken regions. I myself despise Religion and especially Christianity but I pretended to be part of it just to do SOMETHING.
My point is, THERE ARE NO KENYANS that even contribute a single cent for drilling a borehole that could mean life or death to these people.
It seems to me that Kenya consists only of Luo and Kikuyu culture and all other Kenyan tribes are considered primitive. You guys are racists in your own house but have the guts to call others the same.
Most of my friends are “superior” Kenyans of above mentioned tribes and I know what they say and think about each other.
Let me tell you that I live and work in Africa since 20 years. I have 2 children with a Nigga Ho of whom I very proud of. I spend most of my time assisting people in environments that are considered hostile for NO PAY! What does an African do for his own people and for no pay – NOTHING!
But that’s ok with me, in my society is not much of a difference but there is one particular experience I had that could have never had happened anywhere in Europe;
On my second visit to Kenya I was in an ASC bus that collected me and other tourists from the airport. We encountered a huge traffic jam at Mombasa causeway because of an accident.
I had enough time to observe of how an accident victim which was still alive has been ripped of f his shoes and other valuables whilst a crowd of spectators watching. There was nobody amongst those Kenyan people trying to help that pour soul.
The “Proud to be Kenyan” sticker!!! Did you ever hear about people in other countries to pull off such desperate attempt of self hypnosis? Proud of what??? Face it people you can’t’ even maintain your own roads, communications networks and a democracy without expatriates.
Instead to welcome expats that could contribute to technical advancement in Kenya your immigration department is hostile towards foreigners.
If that is the cradle of all mankind I feel ashamed being part of it.

To be continued if your ignorance allows it…

For the sake of debate, please explain what inspired you to post this:

Originally Posted by deliriumtremens

I found out that in the year 1066 b.c., the ooga-booga tribe in central africa had a noble and wise chief known as ooogla-boogla...

And until then, the name deliriumtremens will live to remind many people on this forum of deceit and forgery, of insincerity and racism, of ignorance and ego-driven lies telling.

[t.D.A.]

Originally Posted by deliriumtremens

I guess that I’m just tired of all that white , black, asian, slavery, colonialism junk.
I also know that this is mainly a forum of black people and the opinion of any other member of a different race is to be dismissed as racial. My opinions will even encourage most of you to call me a racist – go ahead I don’t give a F…k
The Irish were slaves, the Chinese were slaves, Christians were tortured and thrown to the lions, Russians were the slaves of Mongolians for over 300 years, Finland was under colonial rule for the bigger part of its history. Germany was bombed out by the British as well as the Japanese by the US
Fact is that none of these countries ever blamed anyone but themselves for their miseries; they just rebuilt their infrastructures and re-instated democratic governments without foreign help.
We all know that (this one goes to Huh) that the US achieved its status as super power on costs of African slaves. The Americans profited in every aspect from slave labor and later on by “forced volunteers” to their Vietnam and Iraq wars.
Today, African Americans (what a nonsense) claim reparations for above mentioned reasons.
I’d say fine, the Jews got compensated (and still are) for the holocaust and Indians still have the right to booze and gambling in the US. But what about crime in the US, by mainly “African brothers”. 50 % of inmates are of “African American” origin. The bigger part of government welfare goes to the “brothers” as well.
You are more likely to be killed or raped by a “brother” than by a White, Asian or Hispanic. The term “Ho” for a female just gives a clue of how much the brothers have advanced the last 3000 years.
Of course, that all must come from a white supremacist guy that never put foot on African soil (R type) I just assume that R type has never been in Lodwar. If he were, he would have realized that this is Kenya as well. Instead he was sitting behind his company computer “having the feeling that something racism” is going on. I volunteer since 20 years for a Christian NGO (just another colonial power) to help with my knowledge and manpower to make things better in some forsaken regions. I myself despise Religion and especially Christianity but I pretended to be part of it just to do SOMETHING.
My point is, THERE ARE NO KENYANS that even contribute a single cent for drilling a borehole that could mean life or death to these people.
It seems to me that Kenya consists only of Luo and Kikuyu culture and all other Kenyan tribes are considered primitive. You guys are racists in your own house but have the guts to call others the same.
Most of my friends are “superior” Kenyans of above mentioned tribes and I know what they say and think about each other.
Let me tell you that I live and work in Africa since 20 years. I have 2 children with a Nigga Ho of whom I very proud of. I spend most of my time assisting people in environments that are considered hostile for NO PAY! What does an African do for his own people and for no pay – NOTHING!
But that’s ok with me, in my society is not much of a difference but there is one particular experience I had that could have never had happened anywhere in Europe;
On my second visit to Kenya I was in an ASC bus that collected me and other tourists from the airport. We encountered a huge traffic jam at Mombasa causeway because of an accident.
I had enough time to observe of how an accident victim which was still alive has been ripped of f his shoes and other valuables whilst a crowd of spectators watching. There was nobody amongst those Kenyan people trying to help that pour soul.
The “Proud to be Kenyan” sticker!!! Did you ever hear about people in other countries to pull off such desperate attempt of self hypnosis? Proud of what??? Face it people you can’t’ even maintain your own roads, communications networks and a democracy without expatriates.
Instead to welcome expats that could contribute to technical advancement in Kenya your immigration department is hostile towards foreigners.
If that is the cradle of all mankind I feel ashamed being part of it.

To be continued if your ignorance allows it…

I detect that we as an African people have hurt you somehow. If that's the case, sorry man. Two wrongs don't make a right man. We are a battered, beaten and bruised people in a lot of ways. We are still trying to rise from the ashes. I don't think engaging in a back and forth debate with you will help you first or this debate second.
Please allow us to continue our discussion and take our continent forward. Who knows before you die you may see the results of discussions such as this one.
Plus, the African American and the African experience are actually two very seperate experiences so please discuss them as such.
Finally, no need for the racist language man, it's just uncalled for to call your so-called-wife a "nigga ho."
So allow us to continue our discussion in peace and go with God man.