[ATLian]

Originally Posted by charuakl

it says in the bib;e that your body is the temple of God so marstabation falls in the list with smoking weed, cigarettes, alcohal, beer wine drugs and many other things.

That's just a phrase. If you take it literally, then everytime a guy sleeps with a woman and comes inside her, you can say that "that man just facked and came in god's temple" and it wouldn't be a blasphemous thing to say. You should go easy on literal intepretations of the Bible!

[ATLian]

Originally Posted by bible_reader

The act is sexual,and if you are imagining someone thats already fornication.If you are imagining doing it with yioourself thats homosexuality.

That's hands down the dumbest thing that's been said on this forum for a very long time!

[ATLian]

[ If,as postulated masturbation is a sin, why is lying with my brother a sin also when clearly its not, as God had commanded it. Who makes this decisions on whats sin or not????

Youngben,

that's an excellent question. It totally exposes the glaring hypocrisy in Christianity when it comes to deciding what is a sin and what isn't. Despite the various warnings around the Bible concerning sex, it's OK for Onan in this scenario to fack Tamar (his dead brother's wife) but it's a mortal sin for him not to come inside her. WTF?

[jasakwa]

Originally Posted by ATLian

That's just a phrase. If you take it literally, then everytime a guy sleeps with a woman and comes inside her, you can say that "that man just facked and came in god's temple" and it wouldn't be a blasphemous thing to say. You should go easy on literal intepretations of the Bible!

Atlian sex in marriage is noble and not blasphemous,so a man sleeping with his wife is very much acceptable.

A believers body being percieved as a temple of God simple meanse the Holy spirit dwells in the spirit of the believer making his body holy.It is sex outside marriage that is unholy.

[jasakwa]

Originally Posted by ATLian

[ If,as postulated masturbation is a sin, why is lying with my brother a sin also when clearly its not, as God had commanded it. Who makes this decisions on whats sin or not????

Youngben,

that's an excellent question. It totally exposes the glaring hypocrisy in Christianity when it comes to deciding what is a sin and what isn't. Despite the various warnings around the Bible concerning sex, it's OK for Onan in this scenario to fack Tamar (his dead brother's wife) but it's a mortal sin for him not to come inside her. WTF?

Lying with your brother is a sin,read roman 1-2.
A sin is when you don't meet the target.

[ndigila]

Lying with your brother is a sin,read roman 1-2.
A sin is when you don't meet the target.

Ati nini?

[jasakwa]

Originally Posted by ndigila

Lying with your brother is a sin,read roman 1-2.
A sin is when you don't meet the target.

Ati nini?

My friend Ndigila,Atlian seem to be having trouble differentiating between sin and the 10 commandments.He is in the assumption that if some vice was not mentioned in the 10 commandments then it is not a sin.
Sin is the disobedience to the LORD GOD's Laws and is unrighteous, unjust, immoral and wrong. The five types of sin, transgression, unrighteousness, omission of known duty, faithlessness, and foolish thinking constitute a sin against the LORD GOD.

Homosexuality as well as lust,gred,pride,hate ,envy,discrimination and such are sins too.

[ATLian]

BTW instead of focusing on just verses 8-10 of Genesis 38, I urge guys to read the entire chapter coz the whole story just gets juicier, and also reveals a disturbing truth about Christianity.

Onan was the son of Judah. Judah is of course one of god's great men. He's so great that he was the founder of the Judah tribe of Israel, a.k.a the Kingdom of Judah, of which Jesus was a member. In fact Jesus was a direct descendant of Judah through Judah's son Phares:

Luke 3:23 - 34: And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed) the son of Joseph, which was the son of Heli ........ which was the son of Phares, which was the son of Juda,which was the son of Juda, Which was the son of Jacob

Matthew 1: 6 - 16: ... and Jacob begat Judas and his brethren, And Judas begat Phares and Zara of Thamar; and Phares begat Esrom; and Esrom begat Aram ........ begat Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ.

Now who the heck was Phares? He was the son of Tamar, who was the wife of Er, who was Onan's brother (and Judah's eldest son), and who god killed for some unknown reason.

So after god kills her husband (Er) and her brother-in-law/new husband (Onan), Tamar gets desperate to get a kiddo. So she goes and disguises herself as a prostitute, and places herself on a path that she knew Judah would be taking. Judah does indeed walk by, and he sees her, and immediately tells her he's love to sleep with her. He uses a line which just cannot work on today's chics:

Genesis 38:16 - I pray thee, let me come in unto thee

So they then negotiate for a price and agree on a kid (baby goat) as her payment. Judah then had sex with her, and since he didn't spill semen like Onan, he ended up getting her pregnant. She got twins, Phares and Zarah. Pharez ended up being the direct descendant of Jesus, meaning that in as much as god hates adultery, he allowed his son to come directly from an adulterous and incestuous line. Another disturbing fact is Onan is killed for coitus interruptus while Judah commits adultery with his daughter-in-law and nothing happens to him. He is infact blessed by god. Like Young Ben asked, who determines when a sin is a sin? Why the double standards by god?

Now this is where I come hard on Christians for their hypocrisy in overlooking some glaring sins that god aso overlooked, yet harping on the sins that god called out. You'll never hear the Christian trash Judah for going to get a prostitute, but they will go on and on about how Onan deserved to die for his sin. WTF?

[rayfisher]

Originally Posted by ATLian

BTW instead of focusing on just verses 8-10 of Genesis 38, I urge guys to read the entire chapter coz the whole story just gets juicier, and also reveals a disturbing truth about Christianity.

Onan was the son of Judah. Judah is of course one of god's great men. He's so great that he was the founder of the Judah tribe of Israel, a.k.a the Kingdom of Judah, of which Jesus was a member. In fact Jesus was a direct descendant of Judah through Judah's son Phares:

Luke 3:23 - 34: And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed) the son of Joseph, which was the son of Heli ........ which was the son of Phares, which was the son of Juda,which was the son of Juda, Which was the son of Jacob

Matthew 1: 6 - 16: ... and Jacob begat Judas and his brethren, And Judas begat Phares and Zara of Thamar; and Phares begat Esrom; and Esrom begat Aram ........ begat Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ.

Now who the heck was Phares? He was the son of Tamar, who was the wife of Er, who was Onan's brother (and Judah's eldest son), and who god killed for some unknown reason.

So after god kills her husband (Er) and her brother-in-law/new husband (Onan), Tamar gets desperate to get a kiddo. So she goes and disguises herself as a prostitute, and places herself on a path that she knew Judah would be taking. Judah does indeed walk by, and he sees her, and immediately tells her he's love to sleep with her. He uses a line which just cannot work on today's chics:

Genesis 38:16 - I pray thee, let me come in unto thee

So they then negotiate for a price and agree on a kid (baby goat) as her payment. Judah then had sex with her, and since he didn't spill semen like Onan, he ended up getting her pregnant. She got twins, Phares and Zarah. Pharez ended up being the direct descendant of Jesus, meaning that in as much as god hates adultery, he allowed his son to come directly from an adulterous and incestuous line. Another disturbing fact is Onan is killed for coitus interruptus while Judah commits adultery with his daughter-in-law and nothing happens to him. He is infact blessed by god. Like Young Ben asked, who determines when a sin is a sin? Why the double standards by god?

Now this is where I come hard on Christians for their hypocrisy in overlooking some glaring sins that god aso overlooked, yet harping on the sins that god called out. You'll never hear the Christian trash Judah for going to get a prostitute, but they will go on and on about how Onan deserved to die for his sin. WTF?

Atlian ,if thats the way you view God then you will never understand the concept of christianity.
Let me try to answer your first question,i have always known that God sent Jesus to come and save the world by serving as an atonement to their sins.If Jesus had to come and save the whole mass of people then it meant he saving even the prostitutes,the murderers,the adulterers etc.Thats why in a certain verse Jesus himself told his critics that he came purposely for sinners,(Mt 9:10-13 While Jesus was having dinner at Matthew's house, many tax collectors and "sinners" came and ate with him and his disciples. When the Pharisees saw this, they asked his disciples, "Why does your teacher eat with tax collectors and 'sinners'?" On hearing this, Jesus said, "It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick. But go and learn what this means: 'I desire mercy, not sacrifice.' For I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners.)and since the grace he gives is not by our righteous action we cannot boast about it.So Jesus came from that line of adulterer(judah) purposely so that even adulterers may find away to share in the atonement.
In Onan's case he wasn't purnished for masturbation,thast why i even disagree with bilble reader on this.Onan was purnished for being disobedient.To God Obedience is very important.You cannot directly equate it to Judah's action as Judah might have sinned by sleeping with a prostitute,but in a way wasn't a mortal sin,but the bible never mentioned anyway in the passage that it was not counted a sin,only rebellion against direct order was worse,(1 Samuel 15:22-23 NIV) "But Samuel replied: "Does the LORD delight in burnt offerings and sacrifices as much as in obeying the voice of the LORD? To obey is better than sacrifice, and to heed is better than the fat of rams. {23} For rebellion is like the sin of divination, and arrogance like the evil of idolatry. Because you have rejected the word of the LORD, he has rejected you as king

[bible_reader]

Originally Posted by fiery_preacher

Exactly my point ray,bible reader should answer whether married people can masturbate.

No,still a sin.Preacher na wewe,Why should a married couple masturbate?where is the essence here.Is human being being superior to other animals if he can masturbate in marriage?

sorry but the concept just doesn't add up.