[Akkatta]

Originally Posted by wajibu

“Good” Christians believe in a living soul and when one dies, the soul goes to heaven. Other believes conscious life ceases until the time of a future resurrection. To me, there is no reference in the bible to a conscious, immortal soul going to heaven or hell or limbo when the body goes to the grave. If we possess soul; where is it located? Nobody has been able to give me a clear answer to that? I have no soul; this self-aware essence is all in the mind. To prove it, think of the following scenarios.
1. If the soul is located in heart what about those people with artificial hearts and still alive. Does that mean they loose a part of there soul
2. If soul is located in your limbs what about the people missing them. I have seen a case of an individual with no limbs and had an artificial heart.
3. If the soul is located in your brains, that means an individual who has gone through lobotomy is missing part of his/her soul.
4. Some of you might argue it is located everywhere; those people who donate there organs, do they leave part of there soul behind. Could a person have two souls?

Help me out here

Hey poko,

Here is an answer to your soul-searching question.

If you have a copy of a bible ( which I desperately hope that you do), turn to Genesis 2:7. 18. You will notice that all living creatures are reffered to as, not having souls but are souls themselves. Then go to Ezekiel 18:4- States that the soul that is sinning it itself will die, doesn't say the man will die and the soul will keep living in limbo somewhere but we are the souls.

Hope that answers your question, post me a reply if you need more information

[ndigila]

Hey poko,

Here is an answer to your soul-searching question.

If you have a copy of a bible ( which I desperately hope that you do), turn to Genesis 2:7. 18. You will notice that all living creatures are reffered to as, not having souls but are souls themselves. Then go to Ezekiel 18:4- States that the soul that is sinning it itself will die, doesn't say the man will die and the soul will keep living in limbo somewhere but we are the souls.

My friend, Jesus disagrees with you.

Matthew 10:28 Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell

Matthew 16:26 What good will it be for a man if he gains the whole world, yet forfeits his soul? Or what can a man give in exchange for his soul?

Matthew 22:37 Jesus replied: " 'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind

[oscarwilde]

intelligent input poko. at least now we know what kind of person u are

[HUH?]

Originally Posted by wajibu

“Good” Christians believe in a living soul and when one dies, the soul goes to heaven. Other believes conscious life ceases until the time of a future resurrection. To me, there is no reference in the bible to a conscious, immortal soul going to heaven or hell or limbo when the body goes to the grave. If we possess soul; where is it located? Nobody has been able to give me a clear answer to that? I have no soul; this self-aware essence is all in the mind. To prove it, think of the following scenarios.
1. If the soul is located in heart what about those people with artificial hearts and still alive. Does that mean they loose a part of there soul
2. If soul is located in your limbs what about the people missing them. I have seen a case of an individual with no limbs and had an artificial heart.
3. If the soul is located in your brains, that means an individual who has gone through lobotomy is missing part of his/her soul.
4. Some of you might argue it is located everywhere; those people who donate there organs, do they leave part of there soul behind. Could a person have two souls?

Help me out here

all i can say is read the book of Phaedo in Plato's dialogues and you'll have a clearer (secular?) idea into the nature of one's soul.

[Atabong]

This question

Where is the soul located?

and the introductory post

“Good” Christians believe in a living soul and when one dies, the soul goes to heaven. Other believes conscious life ceases until the time of a future resurrection. To me, there is no reference in the bible to a conscious, immortal soul going to heaven or hell or limbo when the body goes to the grave. If we possess soul; where is it located? Nobody has been able to give me a clear answer to that? I have no soul; this self-aware essence is all in the mind. To prove it, think of the following scenarios.
1. If the soul is located in heart what about those people with artificial hearts and still alive. Does that mean they loose a part of there soul
2. If soul is located in your limbs what about the people missing them. I have seen a case of an individual with no limbs and had an artificial heart.
3. If the soul is located in your brains, that means an individual who has gone through lobotomy is missing part of his/her soul.
4. Some of you might argue it is located everywhere; those people who donate there organs, do they leave part of there soul behind. Could a person have two souls?

Help me out here

presupposes that the soul exist and is subject to the human body
But this can be said of the soul concept:
1.A formulation of the mind
2.Religiuos rhetoric

[ernestombayo7]

Originally Posted by Atabong

This question and the introductory post presupposes that the soul exist and is subject to the human body
But this can be said of the soul concept:
1.A formulation of the mind
2.Religiuos rhetoric

Actually there is a lot of evidence which suggetsts that a soul exists.

1.Free will - As long as we know that we are not deterministic in nature and can make free choice,then its a sign that we have control of our bodies.

Denying a soul is also denying free-will.If humans are only material,then it means no-one can be held accountable for any action.I can blame my brain cells for coming up with the idea of killing my grandmother.

2. Existence of Morality,no soul no morals, a stoning cannot be called immoral,all is happening is a bag of biological material(human),is propelling a smaller chunk of material(stone) in certain trajectory towards another bag of material with a similar biological make up(the victim).

3. Emotions such as love or hate or anger are evidences of a soul.otherwise these are just chemical reactions triggered by neural processess in the body.so if we had a supercomputer and a very wise programmer,then it is possible to "plant" hate inside someones brain,by triggering all the right neurons.

4.Knowledge is a also a strong evidence of a soul.Its hard to postulate why a material object would acquire knowledge without outside interference,or even why that ,material object would want knowledge in the first place.

there are many others,how would you account for these things if you reject a soul?

[Atabong]

[quote]

Originally Posted by ernestombayo7

Actually there is a lot of evidence which suggetsts that a soul exists.

1.Free will - As long as we know that we are not deterministic in nature and can make free choice,then its a sign that we have control of our bodies.

Denying a soul is also denying free-will.If humans are only material,then it means no-one can be held accountable for any action.I can blame my brain cells for coming up with the idea of killing my grandmother.

a. Your use of the ward 'suggests' means, from time immemorial when people began cooking up these ideas, they have remained just ideas; just philosophical gibberish till date. b. For every action there is a reaction and there can't be a reaction without an action. The reaction also becomes the action to another reaction but then, we have the capabilities/intellect to modify this action as we see fit, so we got choices and free will simple.

2. Existence of Morality,no soul no morals, a stoning cannot be called immoral,all is happening is a bag of biological material(human),is propelling a smaller chunk of material(stone) in certain trajectory towards another bag of material with a similar biological make up(the victim).

Whereas we should live our lives on the basis of common interests, Western people et al decided to frighten Africans with all kinds of concoctions; morals, Soul, God, you name them.

3. Emotions such as love or hate or anger are evidences of a soul.otherwise these are just chemical reactions triggered by neural processess in the body.so if we had a supercomputer and a very wise programmer,then it is possible to "plant" hate inside someones brain,by triggering all the right neurons.

Yes it is now possible to change a person's personality through a computer program.

4.Knowledge is a also a strong evidence of a soul.Its hard to postulate why a material object would acquire knowledge without outside interference,or even why that ,material object would want knowledge in the first place.
there are many others,how would you account for these things if you reject a soul?

Please quote one example/instance where some one acquired knowledge without outside interference. If it's a religious person, that's very understandable. But we got no shred of evidence to claim that the soul (a mere formulation of the mind), exist or do not exist.

[ernestombayo7]

[quote=Atabong;602582]

a. Your use of the ward 'suggests' means, from time immemorial when people began cooking up these ideas, they have remained just ideas; just philosophical gibberish till date. b. For every action there is a reaction and there can't be a reaction without an action. The reaction also becomes the action to another reaction but then, we have the capabilities/intellect to modify this action as we see fit, so we got choices and free will simple.

If you agree that there is free will then you also do agree that there is a soul.The problem here if you deny that there is a soul,then you have to show how material objects can make choices.I gave you the example of me killing my grandmother.
By using your analogy of action/reaction then my act of killing my grandmother is a reaction of chemical/neural processes in the brain.

You do understand denying the soul is denying the "I","Me", or "we".Its simply a body with different behavioral patterns in response to biological,physical,neural and chemical processes in the body and environment.

[quote=Atabong;602582]

Whereas we should live our lives on the basis of common interests, Western people et al decided to frighten Africans with all kinds of concoctions; morals, Soul, God, you name them.

You sort of contradict yourself. You say we should live our lives on the basis of common intrests which implies some sort of moral conduct then you go and then you rubbish/deny morality as a western ideology.

[quote=Atabong;602582]

Yes it is now possible to change a person's personality through a computer program.

Hate is not a personality.

[quote=Atabong;602582]

Please quote one example/instance where some one acquired knowledge without outside interference. If it's a religious person, that's very understandable. But we got no shred of evidence to claim that the soul (a mere formulation of the mind), exist or do not exist.

It depends on what you call evidence.If your looking for observable evidence,then ofcourse there is no observable evidence.We can only infer from hoiw the human body behaves.And looking at some of the points i gave earlier it is reasonable to conclude that a soul exists which makes up our character and "personhood".

Now consider the following,
What evidence do we have that the Mind exists?
Is it obsverbadle under the microscope?or CT scan?
Can you see intelligence?or even thoughts?How much do they weigh?what colour are they?

By using your argument then the mind does not exist since there is no evidence for it.Also thoughts do not exist since there is no evidence for them.

[Atabong]

[quote]

Originally Posted by ernestombayo7

If you agree that there is free will then you also do agree that there is a soul.

To claim that the soul exist is also to claim that the after life exist and there isn’t a shred of evidence apart from ‘religious proofs’ to back this concept. These groups of people talk so much about soul, soul, and soul…
1. Those who want to deceive and frighten others
2. Those living in adversity and don’t have the strength to face the present

I see a future where the CHEMISTRY and PHYSICS of THOUGHT And the Mechanics of Memory will be taught even in kinder Garden. Actually many people consider the soul concept as nothing more than Western rigmarole and debunked.

[ernestombayo7]

[quote=Atabong;605526]

To claim that the soul exist is also to claim that the after life exist and there isn’t a shred of evidence apart from ‘religious proofs’ to back this concept. These groups of people talk so much about soul, soul, and soul…

This is not what i have claimed.Your using A straw man argument.Basically ur misprepresenting my position so as to attack my argument.I did not say having a soul means after-life,What happens to the soul after death is anyones argument.
I could as well say the soul dies with the body.

And again i could ask you what is the proof your looking for that will convince you that there is no life after death?
You should know that scientific methods of proof state that lack of evidence is not proof for absence of evidence.

Since the soul is someones character and personhood,how would you test this after someones dies?
The only way to know what happens after death is actually to die.No wonder there is no evidence!

I see a future where the CHEMISTRY and PHYSICS of THOUGHT And the Mechanics of Memory will be taught even in kinder Garden.

I love science too,so i wish the same too.Only difference is you think it will lead the children to atheism or rejection of religion.

Actually many people consider the soul concept as nothing more than Western rigmarole and debunked.

more of an assertion than an argument.Am happy that you did not even attempt to counter or refute my arguments and went again to chest thump as if it will suddenly make it true or factual.