RE: Take Christ out of christmas? -
12-08-2006, 01:09 PM
A lot of people, including Christians are here criticizing Christmas, yet I'm sure they celebrate every Christmas with fervor. Keminokana shall be the first guy to show up at his church on December 25th.
What is wrong with commemorating the birth and death of Christ? The bible does not mandate the celebration of Christmas or Easter, but what is wrong with doing so? If you base your entire life on faith in this man Jesus, what is wrong with remembering the two events that led to your salvation?
There are several theories for the beggining of the Christmas festivities.
"The eventual choice of December 25, made perhaps as early as 273, reflects a convergence of Origen's concern about pagan gods and the church's identification of God's son with the celestial sun. December 25 already hosted two other related festivals: natalis solis invicti (the Roman "birth of the unconquered sun"), and the birthday of Mithras, the Iranian "Sun of Righteousness" whose worship was popular with Roman soldiers. The winter solstice, another celebration of the sun, fell just a few days earlier. Seeing that pagans were already exalting deities with some parallels to the true deity, church leaders decided to commandeer the date and introduce a new festival."
Wikipedia:
Origin of Christian festival
Sextus Julius Africanus popularized the idea that Jesus was born on December 25 in his Chronographiai, a reference book for Christians written in AD 221.[12] December 25 is nine months after March 25, the Feast of the Annunciation and the presumed date of the Incarnation of Jesus.[16] The choice of March 25 as the date of the Annnunciation was influenced by several factors. It was considered to be the date of the vernal equinox and therefore the creation of Adam.[16] Early Christians believed it was the date Jesus was crucified.[16] The idea that Jesus was conceived on the same date that he died is consistent with a Jewish belief that a prophet lived an integral number of years.[16]
The identification of the birthdate of Jesus did not at first inspire feasting or celebration. In 245, the theologian Origen denounced the idea of celebrating Jesus' birthday "as if he were a king pharaoh." He contended that only sinners, not saints, celebrated their birthdays.
The earliest reference to the celebration of Christmas is in the Calendar of Filocalus, an illuminated manuscript compiled in Rome in 354.[3][17] A reference from 360 indicates that Christmas was well-established in Rome by that time. Christmas was promoted in the east as part of the revival of Trinitarian Christianity following the death of the pro-Arian Emperor Valens at the Battle of Adrianople in 378. It was introduced to Constantinople in 379, to Antioch in about 380, and to Alexandria in about 430. Christmas was especially controversial in Constantinople, the "fortress of Arianism," as Edward Gibbon described it. The feast disappeared after Gregory of Nazianzus resigned as bishop in 381, although it was reintroduced by John Chrysostom in about 400.[3]
RE: Take Christ out of christmas? -
12-08-2006, 03:58 PM
>Atlian,
>
>The bible doesnt recognize christmas and all these easter
>holidays so please desist from confusing them with
>christianity.
Of course the Bible doesn't recognize those holidays. The reason is the Bible was written BEFORE Christianity started. It's therefore Christians who recognize the Bible (not the other way around), and Christianity is but an incorporation of what is in the Bible and their own beliefs and traditions.
My main point above (which you seem to have missed) is that Christianity copied a lot from other older more established religions and traditions. Many of these plagiarized things in Christianity include not only traditions and celebrations (like Easter and Christmas), but also attributes directly related to the Christian god!
>True christianity resides in the bible's writings, nothing
>more, nothing less.
...
>If it is, show us where it is
>written in the bible.
I disagree. Not everything about Christianity comes from the Bible, but it's still accepted as Christianity. e.g.
There's nowhere in the Bible where Jesus ever says that he is god, and there's nowhere in the Bible where the Holy Trinity is discussed. The fact is, like I wrote a while back, some Catholic men met and decided BASED ON A VOTE to create the doctrine of the trinity, which books to include in the Bible, to make Jesus god, etc.
Also, you Christians argue about yourselves about simple stuff like when the Sabbath day should be (Sato or Sunday?), accepting homosexuality, women preachers, celibacy, etc.
Plus, seeing that the Bible is full of so many freaking direct contradictions, which path should a "true" Christian chose to follow when confronted with a glaring contradiction?
>And for the upteenth time for those slow ones, christmas is
>NOT A CHRISTIAN CELEBRATION.
Again I disagree. Christmas is NOT a Biblical celebration, but it is in fact the holiest of all Christian celebrations. Please differentiate the two. No matter what your denomination preaches, Christmas (named after Christ) is a Christian celebration.
RE: Take Christ out of christmas? -
12-09-2006, 01:23 AM
Milanya,
Ah, my dear, as far as I know, i dont celebrate christmas as a commemoration of Jesus' birth. I dont go to church unless the day happens to be on a saturday. For me, it is a day for confused folks to cook so much food, much to the delight of my gluttonous stomach ati they are celebrating.
A true christian and believer commemorates christ's birth, death and resurrection on a daily basis, in everything that he/she does.
It surprises me, people who only go to church once a year on christmas. Surely.
Atlian,
I dont go with what my denomination teaches but what is written in the bible. Christmas is not in it, nobody knows when Jesus was born and as such, to me, the whole thing is just bogus and irrelevant to my faith. But if it means much to you, help yourself!
RE: Take Christ out of christmas? -
12-09-2006, 06:08 PM
You are a Dumbass, Keminokana!Jesus did not tell us in the bible to celebrate his birthday. It was our choice to do so. Just like Martin Luther King didn't tell us to celebrate his birthday. It is Americans who chose to honor him by having a national holiday on his birthday. Please don't ask stupid questions!
Freedom of worship in America has turned into freedom from Christianity. No one stopped Moslems, Jews and other religions from celebrating their religious festivals, but they are attacking Christians from freely expressing their religious views. I cannot stand this "happy holidays" crap! I'll say "Merry Christmas", you can say your "happy Hannukkah" or Kwanzaa, or Eid Ul Fitr!
By the way, these non Christians are all hypocrites. Have a Christmas party at work, and they all act offended. But I never heard any of them getting offended when they get Christmas Eve, Christmas day and Easter off!
RE: Joy to World, the Lord is come -
12-10-2006, 02:13 PM
>By the way, these non Christians are all hypocrites. Have a
>Christmas party at work, and they all act offended. But I
>never heard any of them getting offended when they get
>Christmas Eve, Christmas day and Easter off!
LOL this would be wonderful. make the heathens go to work during Christmas.
Christmas stands for ChristÂ’s Mass. His birth may have been in the spring (shepherds and sheep in the field, the wise men traveling to Jerusalem) rather than winter. the celebration of JesusÂ’ birth started around 336 AD. This date was selected because it coincided with the celebration of the winter solstice, the day on which the sun is reborn because Jesus called himself the light of the world.
To me Christmas signifies the birth of Christ. It is the day God gave his son. For this reason I will join other Christians in fellowship to thank God and celebrate the birth of Christ. And in the spirit of giving I will also give gifts.
The true meaning of Christmas is the birth of Christ in my life.
RE: Take Christ out of christmas? -
12-08-2006, 11:36 AM
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