[ATLian]

>+ however true that may be, ATLian, its all in the old and i
>stress "OLD" testament.
>(why the perfect God "changed his mind" is an argument for
>another time)

Malachi 3:6 "I am the Lord, I change not"

This means that if god was OK with accepting virgin sacrifices in 2000 BC, then you are 100% guaranteed that he was also OK with it in 5 Gabzillion BC and he will be OK with it in in 76 Gabzillion AD! Nothing like a compilation of books written by man will change that. Plus Jesus said that he came to uphold the law, not change it. In other words, even though Jesus knew god was OK with receiving virgin human sacrifices, he did not come to change that law but to remind us to keep doing it.

[reggie_woic]

+ jesus didn't mention anything about it in the bible, and NOWHERE does
He "remind us to keep doing it".
there's probably an explanation on the conflicts between the new and old
testaments....that i don't know of. and believe me i too find it odd
that God "changed".

bottom line: no more religiously accepted deaths in christianity.

[ATLian]

>there's probably an explanation on the conflicts between the
>new and old
>testaments....that i don't know of. and believe me i too find
>it odd
>that God "changed".

Reggie, these things you find "odd" are the foundations of atheism. At some point, too much stuff doesn't make sense, and you get sick and tired of listening to the same old Christian Apologetics garbage. You can either confront them and try find the truth, or do like the ostrich and stick your head into the Christian-hole. That ostrich move is what enables believers to state that yes, my god killed millions of innocent kids, but my god loves all kids...

I think we both agree that god cannot change, because any change would mean he's no longer perfect. Which means that it's man who changed. The men who wrote the Bible and gave god his attributes realized that in a civilized society, you cannot have human sacrifices or stone to death people who work on the Sabbath. So they changed those parts in the NT.



>bottom line: no more religiously accepted deaths in
>christianity.

Again I disagree. e.g. as a Christian, you have to be for the death penalty for murderers because that is what god commanded. Putting a murderer to death would be serving god in the way he wanted. Saying that the death penalty is wrong is ipso facto stating that god was wrong when he made that commandment.

[reggie_woic]

+ God may have been in favor of death in the past, but then again we also have the sixth commandment: thou shalt not kill.

+ we are not robots following a straight and fixed road on how to go
about life. we've got to make up our minds and go with what sounds right
and moral....kinda explains why God gave us the power of will, doesn't
it?

+ that being said, as a catholic i still choose to go with the 6th commandment no matter what.
how about you?

[ATLian]

>+ God may have been in favor of death in the past, but then
>again we also have the sixth commandment: thou shalt not kill.

Reggie,

I think you'll have a tough case trying to argue that god is anti-killing. True, god said "Thou shalt not kill" as one of the commandments. But a ton of what else he did and said in the Bible supports the contrary.

Kwanza, even Moses, the man he gave that "Thou shalt not kill" commandment to, was a murderer. He killed that Egyptian back in Egypt and he was never punished for it. Secondly, he counters that "do not kill" commandment with the commandment "Thou shalt put to death John Doe if he does ..." many more times. He commanded his people to kill homosexuals, adulterers, people who work on the sabbath, people who worship other gods, rapists, etc, to name but a few. BTW most of these commandments were given AFTER he gave Moses the 10 Commandments. Using your logic, shouldn't we observe the latest of those commandments?

The commandment should read "Thou shalt not kill innocent people". But again, there are the times he directed his people to commit genocide on even innocent infants. Plus the times god himself wiped away hundreds of thousands of people for the sins of others. Or the time(s) he had his men kill other people as sacrifices to him. etc. So even that wouldn't hold.

Regardless of how you look at it, it just isn't logical or factual to say that god is against killing when the Bible shows the complete opposite.



>+ that being said, as a catholic i still choose to go with the
>6th commandment no matter what.
>how about you?

You've got to be kidding when you say that you wouldn't kill anyone "no matter what". What would you do in a to-the-death fight with a guy who was hell-bent on killing you, turn your other cheek? What if a suicide bomber is about to blow himself into shreds in a nursery school killing 100 innocent kids with him, and your only option was to blow his brains off to save the kids? Would you watch him do it and feel like a good Christian because you did not break the 6th commandment? I really hope not.

You wrote above that "we are not robots following a straight and fixed road on how to go about life. we've got to make up our minds and go with what sounds right and moral". I know there's nothing like an absolute law that has to be followed at all times no matter what the circumstances. Only robots do that. Sometimes the only moral thing is to kill someone. I can give you a 1,000 situations where a killing would be justified, and where you'd become a hero both under your religion and your country's laws if you did it.

[chotadipo]

>while christianity has now completely embraced life even of
>the most vile humans possible,
>things don't seem to have changed much on the African religion
>part.
>
Please site an example of the above.

[reggie_woic]

http://www.mymac.com/avatars/stewie.gif

http://www.afrikaworld.net/afrel/community.htm
took me a few seconds to find.
enjoy.