[teejay]

>-They dont allow divorce
>-They dont support or condone the use of
>contraceptives and abortion as a meand
>of population control.
>-They dont allow their priests, sisters
>and nuns to get married
>
>How more conservative can the catholic
>church be, Mr byro99

I guess they tell to continue to stay with your adultrous unafaithfull wives.

Where in the bible does it say thou shalt not serve God if you are married...or is this one of the commandments that was added to suit the celibacy of those homosexual clergy men in the back rooms.

Even Paul in his teachings advocates for marrying if need be.

God himself makes a woman out of man's ribs For the man.So why should the catholic church deprive their clergymen of the marriage right only to finacially cover up later on for their uncontrolled sexual appetite which is executed on the unsuspecting kids?????

If you say the C-church is conservative of that then hatuna pingamizi kwa sababu hiyo imekuwa tabia yao hata baba yao mkubwa anajua.

[MercedesK]

Just tell God that you are scared to be Catholic because the Priest abused your friend. He will understand!!!!

[Chameleon]

The catholic church is as faulty as any other church organization.

Mind you I am not a Catholic, actually the closest I have been to catholisim is when I went to a Catholic school for my high school education.

I always have a problem when people pressure the church to change its old age rules and regulations to conform to the current social behaviour needs.

Why should the catholic church appoint Homosexuals as priests, allow priests to marry or condone abortion just because such things are acceptable in todays civil world.

What is wrong according to God will always be wrong no matter how human beings evolve or become more "modernized".

Being a priest or nun is a matter of choice. There are rules that you have to agree on before you join the priesthood or sister hood. And one of the most important rules is the rule of celebecy. And if you cant observe this rule then dont join the priesthood.

I do know the sadistic history of the Catholic church, from the infamous corrupt Popes to the catholic tolerance of jews oppression. But those are by gones.

We should the Church a break. This are the only remaining institutions that have maintained their principles even in this growing secular world whereby everything is OKAY and COOL as long as it doesnt bother you.

[kibz]

The Catholic church is too conservative & it's time for a tune-up.When Galileo(I stand to be corrected) said the world was not the centre of the universe,he was to be executed for blasphemy before recanting what the church later confirmed to be true...

Today the Catholic church's stand on condoms & celibacy is being shaken.All this talk about Priests having sex with kid's e.t.c is not new,the spotlight is just confirming what has been the priests MO...

The Pope is about to croke & he will leave a huge mess behind like his predecessor who died in his sleep(yah right).The church should not only get rid of celibacy but should distribute condoms to it's priests...

[Tinkerbell]

>WHO THE ##### IS JESUS CHRIST? CAN ONE
>OF YOU EXPLAIN TO ME WHO JESUS IS? WHY
>DO YOU BELIEVE IN HIM? HOW IN LIFE DOES
>HE HELP YOUR BLACK ASS? WHY DONT YOU
>BELIEVE IN SCHARON AND THE REST OF THEM
>ISRAELITES?WHY DO YOU ACCEPT THE
>BRAINWASH?FOR THE KYUKS; DO YOU KNOW
>WHAT MUGO WA KIBIRU SAID?


No words...may the Lord save you(comes from the polite Tinkerbell)


HOW DARE YOU, WHO DO YOU THINK YOU ARE POSTING SUCH THREADS? tAKE YOUR BULL****,SOMEWHERE ELSE!

Ifuo ka Chieth! You dare include the word ##### when referring to the creator?? Whether you believe in Jesus or not, is not an issue here, You must learn to respect peoples religions.

TAKE CARE YOU MAY LOOSE YOUR MOUTH!!!


Tinkerbell has talked

[Babe]

Onyango72,
I beg to differ with you on your understanding of baptism, so what is your take on this verse and many more like it,"Baptism . . . now saves you, not as a removal of dirt from the body, but as an appeal to God for a clear conscience, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ" (1 Pet. 3:21; Acts 2:38, 22:16, Rom. 6:3–4, Col. 2:11–12).

As for paradise referred to by our Lord to the thief on the cross beside Him being heaven, I totally disagree with you also there. Since the bible tells us Christ didn't ascend to the Father until after ressurection, which explains why he told Mary that he had not gone to the Father. My understanding of this paradise, he was referring to purgatory, which is where he was in the three days that he was dead to bring salvation to those who had died before his coming.

The Catechism of the Catholic Church is the book that teaches all matters of morals and faith as taught by Christ and handed over from the apostles to us over the years. While we must guard against merely human tradition, the Bible contains numerous references to the necessity of clinging to apostolic tradition.

Thus Paul tells the Corinthians, "I commend you because you remember me in everything and maintain the traditions even as I have delivered them to you" (1 Cor. 11:2), and he commands the Thessalonians, "So then, brethren, stand firm and hold to the traditions which you were taught by us, either by word of mouth or by letter" (2 Thess. 2:15). He even goes so far as to order, "Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you keep away from any brother who is living in idleness and not in accord with the tradition that you received from us" (2 Thess. 3:6).

To make sure that the apostolic tradition would be passed down after the deaths of the apostles, Paul told Timothy, "What you have heard from me before many witnesses entrust to faithful men who will be able to teach others also" (2 Tim. 2:2).

[MRACHE]

This goes to you Tinker bell may be you think your a macho guy and nothing can go through you.God send jesus for us even you because he loves us so much.Just in case you dont know god is all knowing ,powerfull and very faithfull among other characters.He knows even your in ##### even when you talk trash please check out how you refer to him he watches over you day and night even know he is watching youand he loves you.He walks with you even during your dark times.I HOPE I HAVE TOLD ALL YOU WANTED TO KNOW IT WOULD BE BETTER IF YOU CAN ACCEPT HIM IN YOUR LIFE

[ekubwa]

>>It is true that proportionately the
>number of deviant Catholic priest is a
>very small number, but the fact that the
>Catholic church undertook a masive
>coverup operation by paying off anyone
>who sued them, and shuffled the errant
>priests into other parrishes without
>warning the local community thus
>permitting them to prey on their
>congregation over and over again is
>unforgiveable.
>



When speaking of a cover up operation....chief haven't you ever heard of out-of-court settlements? Even people who sue drug companies end up settling out of court in order to avoid unnecessary legal expenses, and even though they ended up in court after a long trial they would still end up being paid...a settlement determined by the judge or jury. Therefore an out of court settlement does not mean they have not faced up to the wrong they have done...they have.

Is it because the church is getting all this coverage, what do you say about the pastors and reverends in other churches who also go against what faith teaches?

It's unfortunate that all this is happening, but meanwhile as you cast the stone think of the good the church too has done to the world community as a whole.

[Muhubiri]

The role of being born again is no different from that of a baby being born. It happen because the time has come. A child has no objection as to what, where or who they are born. It just happens. When we are born-again, God does the work, we stand back and we are born. Ater we are born we get washed up. We might make a little protest, but that is of no avail. Try to ask a baby about the process, bus he/she cannot explain, they are just happy to be alive. In due time, the baby will understand the whys and hows.

This is for those who have read this thread and are asking .. why all the hooopla...
The work of God in our lives is compared to that of the clay to the potter. The clay does zero work and the porter does 100%
God prepared the whole theatre of salvation. If God wills that you are saved, forget the plans of how you han planned to do it God takes over. God choose you before you appeared in your mothers womb .. imagine that.

Why all the hoopla ....

Whether you are sprinkled, dunked or poured upon all you will get is wet. God is at work please stay still and contemplate what it all means.

If you are keeping score God has 100% man has 0

Why all the hoopla ....

Be thankful that God choose to save you.

SSShhhhh.......

God is at work

Remember God 100 man 0

[Babe]

Onyango72,
We are born-again through water and spirit. Here are some of the scriptural references to it.

John 1:33 - when Jesus was baptized, he was baptized in the water and Spirit. The Holy Spirit and water are required for baptism.
John 3:3,5 - truly, truly, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. This means baptism.
Mark 16:16 - Jesus said "He who believes AND is baptized will be saved." Believing is not enough. Baptism is also required.
John 3:3,5 - unless we are born of water and Spirit in baptism, we cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
Acts 9:18 - Paul, even though directly chosen by Christ and immediately converted, still had to be baptized to be forgiven his sin.
Acts 22:16 - Ananias tells Paul, "arise and be baptized, and wash away your sins," even though Paul was converted directly by Jesus Christ.
Titus 3:5 - He saved us by the washing of regeneration and renewal in the Holy Spirit. Regeneration is not symbolic.
Heb. 10:22 - in baptism, our hearts are sprinkled clean as our bodies are washed with pure water. It is a regeneration of the soul.
Luke 23:39-43 - the good thief shows that there is also baptism by desire. "Paradise" means sheol or the realm of the righteous dead (it does not mean heaven).
Isaiah 44:3 - the Lord pours out His water and His Spirit. Water and the Spirit are linked to baptism. The Bible never separates them.
Ezek. 36:25-27 - the Lord promises He will sprinkle us with water to cleanse us from sin and give us a new heart and spirit.